money

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Kalashnikov_Blues
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Joined: 19-09-03
Oct 20 2004 00:14
money

Ok, I havent the time at the moment to read this over,but at a cursery glance its looks pretty cool.

Nutshelled, a pretty large town (Ithaca, NY is a pretty big town, probably a city actually) has set up a local currency which has been goin since 93. Basically just to support the local economy, big I think it sounds like a pretty cool/interesting way of reclaiming community autonomy.

this is why booze is bad... you forget to include the key part of the post...

http://www.ithacahours.org

happyanarchy
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Joined: 24-09-04
Oct 20 2004 06:23

Yeah, more then a few collectives did this during the spanish revolution.

I think the alternative currency is good step towards greater autonomy if a region has a strong mutualist/co-operative movement, or interacting intentional communities. Then it can really be useful in building community controlled capital.

If the region is still dominated by private capital including small business, I don't see it as much more then a nice novelty.

It is interesting though to see that in Ithica there seems to be significantly more community groups signed up for the currency then private business.

Does anyone know if Christiania has it's own currency?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_State_of_Christiania

Mike Harman
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Joined: 7-02-06
Oct 20 2004 11:11

Isn't it about the same as LETS in the UK?

http://www.letslinkuk.net/

I remember looking into this a lot when I was into mutualism, but then I remember seeing an article that they'd started being taxable, which ruined it for me, and left it alone.

Anyway, somewhere along the line, it's from Josiah Warren.

http://faculty.evansville.edu/ck6/bstud/warren.html

Quote:

The time store was started by my father for the purpose of illustrating the labor-for-labor system. The goods he bought principally of Evansville merchants. The customers would come in and ask for what was wanted. The time dial was set to correspond with the minute hand of the clock and when the customer was through with his purchase, the time required in waiting on him was figured up; this labor was paid by the customer in labor notes, and the cost of the goods was paid in cash. There was no profit added to the first cost of the goods, except the amount expended in freight, bills, and other incidentals. The labor notes, of course, represented all classes—merchants, farmers, doctors, and every description of laborer, and the rates per hour were regulated by the cost to the person of having to spend the time in learning the business in which he was engaged. I remember that a large number of the citizens of the town and country contiguous used to meet once every two weeks at the "Hall," fitted up in a large building called "No. 1" which belonged to my father. In this [building] were also the shops where the library printing presses, type cases, etc., were being made.

The friends of the labor movement met, and the question was discussed, the prices of different kinds of labor suggested, and acted upon.

http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/warren/warren.html

Mike Harman
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Joined: 7-02-06
Oct 20 2004 16:26

Not only that, but having just taken a look at it (LETS), percentages are taken out for "administration", and it might still be income taxable - if it's taxed it doesn't properly represent labour time, and sends value out of the community, not into it. Didn't realise it was as big as it is, looks like it's everywhere. Same problems as any other currency, but Revol, what do your mates say about it?

yozzee
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Joined: 4-07-04
Oct 20 2004 20:15

Isn't LETS just an extension of the idea of the barter economy, placing a monetary value on time/effort involved. Any thoughts on a gift economy?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gift_economy

yozzee
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Joined: 4-07-04
Oct 20 2004 21:20

Do you mean LETTS or a gift economy?

yozzee
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Joined: 4-07-04
Oct 20 2004 21:40

Yeah I reckon filesharing and the whole freeware movement is part of a gift economy. From what I can understand it's about giving freely what you have to the whole community rather than placing a value on it and bartering or swapping.

Mike Harman
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Joined: 7-02-06
Oct 20 2004 22:55

Dunno about that Revol, I thinkOpen Source software takes that particular prize.

Ignoring music and films, file-shared software could potentially lead to purchases later on, open-source, by offering it free in the first place, prevents purchases, completely removes exchange from the process of distribution. The Iraqi Linux User Group (or similar name) was complaining that Microsoft and other countries had flooded the country with pirate copies in order to hook people for later. Lots of file sharing companies heavily protect the copyright on their software as well (recent legal action by Kazaa against an ad-free clone).

There's also a lot of musicians offering music for free - no option to buy, at least for specific recordings. Again, whereas if I heard something from filesharing and really liked it I might pick it up properly to get liner-notes etc., if it's completely free in the first place, it removes that potential altogether.

LiveFastDiarrea
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Joined: 19-09-03
Oct 21 2004 09:24

You can get Half life for linux can't you?