... or barbarism?

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working class
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Joined: 1-05-11
Jun 7 2011 03:33
... or barbarism?

Should we be thinking about the possibility that socialism might not come about or a revolution might fail or no revolution ever happens and instead, capitalism just disintegrates completely leaving just barbarism?

Sean68
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Joined: 27-09-06
Jun 7 2011 04:33

barbarism is what is going on outside the circuit of capitalism. It's why every poor sod on the planet with access to a paddle is desperately trying to get inside the citadel of capitalism.

Sean68
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Joined: 27-09-06
Jun 7 2011 05:15

...And anyway, what's so bad about life in the UK anyway? What you got to moan about? As long as you got some pals, a wee drink or two, if your lucky...very lucky...a lover...what is there to gripe about really?

Harrison
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Joined: 16-11-10
Jun 7 2011 07:57

Sean68 your posts are so weird

Angelus Novus
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Joined: 27-07-06
Jun 7 2011 13:11
Sean68 wrote:
...And anyway, what's so bad about life in the UK anyway? What you got to moan about? As long as you got some pals, a wee drink or two, if your lucky...very lucky...a lover...what is there to gripe about really?

Interesting. So I take it the Germanophiles at PD have given up on Nuremberg Wertkritik and have decided to adopt the positions of Bahamas instead? How does one reconcile Germanophilia with Anti-Germanism, anyway?

What tipped your loyalties? My pointing out that your fallen idol Robert Kurz doesn't share the Frankfurt School's idea of the "totally administered society"?

Sean68 gets more unintentionally hilarious every week. Pretty soon PD will have run the full spectrum of German political sects to orient towards.

Hauptsache deutsch, nicht wahr?

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cantdocartwheels
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Joined: 15-03-04
Jun 10 2011 23:00
working class wrote:
Should we be thinking about the possibility that socialism might not come about or a revolution might fail or no revolution ever happens and instead, capitalism just disintegrates completely leaving just barbarism?

Capitalism can only really collpase, if we have an absolute resource crisis and environmental destruction and/or a nuclear war. If said apocalyptic scenarios play out long enough then the world we get at the end of it probably won;t be worth living in.
eg http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2023790698427111488#
Thus the idea of dwelling too much on the subject is a bit futile. If it happens we're fucked basically.

slothjabber
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Joined: 1-08-06
Jun 11 2011 22:54

I agree, better to focus on preventing that situation by overcomming it as soon as possible. Because if we waste a lot of effort planning for what happens if the revolution fails, then there's even less chance of the revolution succeeding - not because we'll thinking, "well, there's always the fallback plan of living in the cave we bought in Borneo, I needn't try very hard", but because we'lkl have spent our time and effort and resources on cave-shopping and learning how to flint-knap, instead of using said time effort and resources to involve ourselves in the revolutionary process.

Basically, if we can't sort it out, we've left the world for the Primmoes, which I would have thought is enough of a spur to motivate all of us.

Baronarchist
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Joined: 22-06-11
Jun 26 2011 18:05

Is there any chance a spurred revolution would happen if Capitalism disintegrated? Although it would probably be an authoritarian leninist-esque bullshit goverment...

Samotnaf
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Joined: 9-06-09
Jun 26 2011 19:25

The possiblity of no revolution is one that most people accept in their miserable cynical pessimism. Yet, in the past, the recognition that things will get immeasurably worse if there is no confrontation with the forces defending this society has been one of the motivations for social contestation. So as a spur to action and the critical theories that can carry such action forward, the spectre of apocalypse, understood not in its usual Hollywood presentations, can have a catalytic effect (as long as such theoretical reflections are also accompanied by far less speculative insights, such as insights into the contradictions of movements that clearly oppose such "barbarism"). Neither optimism nor pessimism but conscious action, theoretical practice, is the perspective that cuts through the false choices of different forms of resignation.