Mishima

16 posts / 0 new
Last post
wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 10:53
Mishima

Does anyone have an opinion on yukio mishima, his works or belief in a 'beautiful death'?

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 10:54

Fash

wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 11:10

Lol so libcom. Care to expand? And dont just say fascist. tongue

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 11:19

It's been ages since I read him but my recollection is that he was obsessed with physical perfection, returning to a mythical perfect imperial past, the honour of war, the military, nationalism, "great leaders" etc.

Happy to be corrected if he was actually just a misunderstood anarcho-communist but I think that is unlikely.

wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 11:33

Hehe sounds about right. I'm only interested in the honour (compared to the dishonour of work?) and death bit.

Entdinglichung's picture
Entdinglichung
Offline
Joined: 2-07-08
Nov 12 2015 15:12

according to a friend who read some of his literary stuff, Mishima was one of the few fascists who was also a talented writer ... and he inspired one Stranglers song

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 11:50

I think honour is an interesting idea, but it is historically tied up with all kinds of dubious nonsense like chastity.

What does it mean to you?

wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 12:09

If i were to put a samurai sword to my stomach then dignity. Add that to at least physical self-actualisation before the end and you have a romantic idea imho. Happy to be persuaded otherwise though hence the op. smile

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 12:19

Dignity is fine - I would guess you could argue that communism is a state where dignity is extended to all. (Freedom from want, degradation etc).

Honour seems to overlap with that but the emphasis seems to be on the individual to behave in a particular way, to adhere to certain codes. What those codes are will be dependent on the wider culture and interpretation.

A lot of which seems to be quite patriarchal - "a man of honour" is like a knight. Who will "defend a woman's honour".

I support dignity in dying http://www.dignityindying.org.uk/ but I think you mean something different?

The Wikipedia page on Seppuku makes it look pretty fucked up - suicide because of shame, because your master has died, because your husband has died, etc.

wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 12:25

Yeah, i agree with you entirely. Just get depressed lol.

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 12:29

Sorry to hear that.

Maybe SPK's "turn illness into a weapon" or Mad Pride is more useful than Mishima? wink

wojtek
Offline
Joined: 8-01-11
Nov 12 2015 12:38

Ta, im fine though x

Fozzie's picture
Fozzie
Offline
Joined: 4-12-03
Nov 12 2015 12:44

Good!

Auld-bod's picture
Auld-bod
Offline
Joined: 9-07-11
Nov 12 2015 13:14

I have not read any Yukio Mishima.
Some years ago I did read, ‘Zen Showed Me The Way’ (1960), by the actor Sessue Hayakawa. He was the fellow who played ‘Colonel Saito’, in the film, ‘The Bridge Over The River Kwai’ (1957).

His book is interesting and amongst other things, gives an insight into the suicidal rituals of that generation of Japanese. His agonising description of his own failed attempt to disembowel himself and his painful physical and spiritual rehabilitation is well written. Makes the ‘honourable’ tales of King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table pale by comparison and is of course just as irrelevant.

jef costello's picture
jef costello
Offline
Joined: 9-02-06
Nov 12 2015 20:43

I think putting that much effort into suicide shows a desperate need to feel that life has some kind of meaning.

jojo
Offline
Joined: 30-06-12
Nov 13 2015 02:12

I read something by Mishima years ago. Can't remember the name. But it was about two boys who drugged a soldier by getting him to drink something used in surgery to put people to sleep. They then removed his shirt and prepared to open his chest using a surgical scalpel, to see how his heart worked. End of story.

My impression was of an over-powering sense of repression being given a limited kind of voice. The repressed elements included homosexual feelings, sadism, cruelty, love, pornographic yearnings and curiosity, motivations to dominance and other stuff difficult to name.

I think that putting that much effort into the repression of a particular kind of emotional and sexual desire shows a desperate need to do dirt on life and must inevitably point towards suicide as both the punishment and the way out.