'Meinhof gang killer to be freed'

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Anonymous
Feb 12 2007 11:19
'Meinhof gang killer to be freed'
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A former member of the Baader-Meinhof gang is to be freed on probation after serving 24 years for her involvement in kidnappings and murders in the 1970s.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6352903.stm

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Feb 12 2007 11:35
wikipedia wrote:
Brigitte Margret Ida Mohnhaupt ...was a member of the Socialist Patients Collective (SPK) and ...the militant Red Army Faction (RAF).

Is that the same SPK who were at the London Bookfair then?

powertotheimagi...
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Feb 12 2007 15:35
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A professor at the university has acknowledged that he had been studying Ms Meinhof's brain to see whether the tumour surgery she had in the 1960s influenced her slide into political extremism.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/2596013.stm

That explains it.

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Feb 12 2007 15:48

christ. that, james wooley if you're reading, is an example of bourgeois rationalism - if someone rejects rational, orderly bourgeois society they're mad, irrational, malfunctioning.

of course the RAF were a bit shit, but the point stands.

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the button
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Feb 12 2007 15:52
Joseph K. wrote:
the RAF were a bit shit, but the point stands.

Say what you like about them, they were a lot better-looking than our home-grown terrorists.

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Joseph Kay
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Feb 12 2007 15:59

it's true cry

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the button
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Feb 12 2007 16:13

No totty pics! angry

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Joseph Kay
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Feb 12 2007 16:15

he is quite a looker, but while the germans have their share of beardies i still think they shave it (badoom tssch!):

Black Flag
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Feb 12 2007 16:24

why were the RAF a bit shit? killing war criminals sounds fair enough to me.Obviously they were marxists but apart from that why were they a bit shit,unless if thats what you meant.

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Feb 12 2007 16:31

well some of their targets were scumbags without a doubt. but a few of the shit things ...

- they were supported by the USSR
- what did urban guerilla shenanigans have to do with class struggle?
- their strategy seemed to be to provoke the state to clamp down, and thus provoke revolution - machiavellian nonsense with shit consequences for the working class should it work
- they were soft on arab nationalists and generally a bit third-worldist
- they shot random 'collaborators' like judges' chauffeurs and the librarian who was with baader when he escaped

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Feb 12 2007 16:35

But on the plus side, Andreas Baader was a skilled contortionist, as -- according to German police -- he managed to shoot himself in the back of the head. cool

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Jacques Roux
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Feb 12 2007 16:38

Didn't they bomb department stores in their early days?

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Joseph Kay
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Feb 12 2007 16:41
the button wrote:
But on the plus side, Andreas Baader was a skilled contortionist, as -- according to German police -- he managed to shoot himself in the back of the head. cool

can be done with your thumb on the trigger i think, if you're so inclined. assuming we're talking pistols. but on this we've got one up on the germans, our lads at deepcut shoot themselves multiple times from range. rule britania!

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Feb 12 2007 16:49
Joseph K. wrote:
but on this we've got one up on the germans, our lads at deepcut shoot themselves multiple times from range. rule britania!

I knew we could stick it to the bosch somehow. Curse them and their attractive lady terrorists! angry

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Feb 12 2007 16:51
revol68 wrote:
the button wrote:
Joseph K. wrote:
but on this we've got one up on the germans, our lads at deepcut shoot themselves multiple times from range. rule britania!

I knew we could stick it to the bosch somehow. Curse them and their attractive lady terrorists! angry

stick it to them more than two world wars?

.... and the one world cup, don't forget.

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Feb 12 2007 17:03
rkn wrote:
Didn't they bomb department stores in their early days?

set one or two on fire wasn't it? rather than bombs. can't remember exactly but it doesn't really matter

Weren't a couple of the Angry Brigade girls quite good looking though?

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Feb 12 2007 17:15
rkn wrote:
Didn't they bomb department stores in their early days?

I was hoping someone was going to say that, since that was by far the worst thing about them. The whole ''we need to bring vietnam to germany because no-one cares about the vietnamese'' thing, not much to do with class struggle basically.

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Feb 12 2007 17:31
Big Jack McTussoch wrote:
why were the RAF a bit shit? killing war criminals sounds fair enough to me.Obviously they were marxists but apart from that why were they a bit shit,unless if thats what you meant.

People have presented lots of criticisms - and they also bombed a print works and maimed 17 workers, though that's not really their fault since they phoned in a warning which the bosses didn't pass on cos they wanted to make political capital out of workers getting killed by the RAF.

There's dodgy nationalism, national liberationism and anti-Americanism in their writings, which for some of them progressed to the point where former-RAF member, and their lawyer, Horst Mahler, is now head of the NPD, the biggest Nazi party in Germany. Not that big a jump from nationalist Stalinism to plain national socialism really.

That said in the early 1990s they passed a non-violence policy towards people, and pulled off possibly the coolest guerrilla action of all time blowing up a new $200-odd million prison which would have housed RAF prisoners, without hurting anyone.

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Feb 12 2007 17:56
John. wrote:
There's dodgy nationalism, national liberationism and anti-Americanism in their writings, which for some of them progressed to the point where former-RAF member, and their lawyer, Horst Mahler, is now head of the NPD, the biggest Nazi party in Germany. Not that big a jump from nationalist Stalinism to plain national socialism really.

fuck i forgot about that!

John. wrote:
That said in the early 1990s they passed a non-violence policy towards people, and pulled off possibly the coolest guerrilla action of all time blowing up a new $200-odd million prison which would have housed RAF prisoners, without hurting anyone.

that is pretty cool - they didn't spoil it by tagging 'free all prisoners' on the rubble did they?

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Feb 12 2007 18:08
Quote:
24 May 1967, Berlin
Two days after a devastating fire sweeps through a Brussels department store, members of Kommune I, a radical commune, pass out a leaflet at Berlin's Free University which jokingly suggests that a good way to bring the Marxist Revolution home is to deliberately burn down department stores. Kommune I members Fritz Teufel and Rainer Langhans were arrested and charged with inciting arson.

22 March, Berlin
Fritz Teufel and Rainer Langhans are found Not Guilty of Incitement to Arson, for passing out the leaflets the previous spring. According to Baader-Meinhof biographer Jillian Becker, the expert witnesses agree, "the pamphlets were literary compositions, not to be acted on but for theoretical considerations only." Theoretical to everyone, it seems, except Andreas Baader and his new girlfriend Gudrun Ensslin.

2 April, Frankfurt am Main
Baader and Ensslin head to Frankfurt am Main with two friends, Horst Söhnlein and Thorwald Proll. Baader has acquired quite a reputation as a "dangerous" sort by his constant calls for violent action. Invariably no one would choose to act on his "suggestions." Today is different. This time Baader's fellow comrades elect to take Baader up on his suggestion to burn down a department store.

Later that night Baader and Ensslin leave two time bombs in the Kaufhaus Schneider department store. Söhnlein and Proll leave a bomb in the Kaufhof store. At midnight the bombs go off, ultimately causing about $200,000 worth of damage. While the first flames appear, Ensslin is on a pay phone, screaming at the German Press Agency, "This is a political act of revenge!"

4 April, Frankfurt
Unable to keep their deeds a secret, police arrest Baader and his comrades for the arsons.

from http://www.baader-meinhof.com/timeline/

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Feb 12 2007 18:13

but its ok, our plucky hero escaped, and they only had to shoot the one librarian!

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Feb 13 2007 05:22
John. wrote:
There's dodgy nationalism, national liberationism and anti-Americanism in their writings, which for some of them progressed to the point where former-RAF member, and their lawyer, Horst Mahler, is now head of the NPD, the biggest Nazi party in Germany. Not that big a jump from nationalist Stalinism to plain national socialism really.

Mahler –wo is in prison for antisemitic propaganda at present– is not head of the NPD, but a prominent member of that nazi thug party. Mahler was only a short-time member of the RAF in the early 70th. They kicked him out in 1974, because he became a member of an ultra-nationalist maoist party (KPD/AO). I guess the latter membership was something that made him far compatible with fascism than did the stupid third-worldism of the RAF. There were other prominent Nazis that startet as Maoists, like Kühnen (FAP) for instance.

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Feb 13 2007 05:37
Felix Frost wrote:
(...)Later that night Baader and Ensslin leave two time bombs in the Kaufhaus Schneider department store.(...)

Felix, what do you like to tell us by this? This was years before the founding of the RAF. Most of the people mentioned here like Fritz Teufel, Rainer Langhans, Thorwald Proll have never been a member of the RAF. Fritz Teufel was an anarchist and was put it in prison for beeing a member of an anarchist urban guerilla group called "Bewegung 2. Juni", Thorwald Proll was an anarchist as well and Rainer Langhans later made into a foolish new-ageist. The RAF would have never comitted such a sort of "situationist" arson because their background was not a militant critics of the society of spectacles but an armed support for "national-liberation movements". They had no interest in class or social struggles within the first world.

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Feb 13 2007 09:28
the button wrote:
I knew we could stick it to the bosch somehow. Curse them and their attractive lady terrorists! angry

Huns!
Are you a frog or something?

ftony
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Feb 13 2007 10:17
rkn wrote:
Didn't they bomb department stores in their early days?

think so, yeah. but then again our loveable friendly little band of insurrcetionists the Angry Brigade bombed a london boutique too

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Feb 13 2007 10:27

and they were uglier than the RAF

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Feb 13 2007 10:38
Big Jack McTussoch wrote:
why were the RAF a bit shit? killing war criminals sounds fair enough to me.Obviously they were marxists but apart from that why were they a bit shit,unless if thats what you meant.

robot wrote:
Felix Frost wrote:
(...)Later that night Baader and Ensslin leave two time bombs in the Kaufhaus Schneider department store.(...)

Felix, what do you like to tell us by this? This was years before the founding of the RAF. Most of the people mentioned here like Fritz Teufel, Rainer Langhans, Thorwald Proll have never been a member of the RAF. Fritz Teufel was an anarchist and was put it in prison for beeing a member of an anarchist urban guerilla group called "Bewegung 2. Juni", Thorwald Proll was an anarchist as well and Rainer Langhans later made into a foolish new-ageist. The RAF would have never comitted such a sort of "situationist" arson because their background was not a militant critics of the society of spectacles but an armed support for "national-liberation movements". They had no interest in class or social struggles within the first world.

Does it matter whether these leftist armed groups were 'Marxist', or 'anarchist urban guerilla(s)'?

The point is about their activity, and its relationship to the class struggle, which is none whatsoever as far as I can see, not which dodgy ideology they chose to back it up with.

Devrim

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Feb 13 2007 10:51

Hey robot thanks for the information.

lem
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Feb 13 2007 12:08
John. wrote:
Hey robot thanks for the information.

Oi leave Devrim alone angry

tongue

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Joseph Kay
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Feb 13 2007 12:16

grin

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Feb 13 2007 13:20
robot wrote:
Felix Frost wrote:
(...)Later that night Baader and Ensslin leave two time bombs in the Kaufhaus Schneider department store.(...)

Felix, what do you like to tell us by this? This was years before the founding of the RAF.

Mostly, it's just a bit of historical trivia, which I posted because other posters asked about the department store bombings. I do think it says something about where RAF and other "urban guerilla groups" were coming from, though. And I agree with Devrim in that I don't really see any difference between the "anarchist" armed groups and the "marxsist-leninist" ones.

And for a bit more trivia, according to the same site as I was quoting from earler, Rainer Langhans was arrested in 79 for trying to bomb Richard Nixons motorcade during his visit to Berlin. It didn't say whether he did it in support of third world liberation movements or as a militant protest against the society of the spectacle, though.