Moving to Israel

19 posts / 0 new
Last post
sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Jul 8 2010 02:58
Moving to Israel

So I might be looking to move to Israel for my work. I'm trying to weigh out the pro's and con's. Feel free to add your opinions. BTW, I am aware of the political situation there.

gypsy
Offline
Joined: 20-09-09
Jul 8 2010 06:32

Aslong as you don't join the IDF I don't have an opinion.

Tojiah's picture
Tojiah
Offline
Joined: 2-10-06
Jul 8 2010 06:40

Really depends on where you're moving from, and what kind of work it is.

sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Jul 6 2012 09:35

IDF...lol. Maybe the AATW, but TBH I dont know much about them. Their really isn't a syndicalist union over there (that I know of anyways).

I'm a [edited out by poster] in the NW right now. I'd be doing the same thing over there.

I have been to Dubai, Bahrain, and Athens before so I'm not totally in the dark of what that areas like. America blows, so if I get the opportunity to move I might take it. Especially if it gets me closer to Europe.

slothjabber
Offline
Joined: 1-08-06
Jul 8 2010 09:51

Good luck comrade.

Apparently there was an anarcho-syndicalist and cross-cultural union set up there, but that was in the 1920s and it was surpressed by the British administration, so that's probably not a lot of use. Are the IWW operative in Israel?

I take it that you're not going to be there long term, given that you've done stints in the Gulf and Greece. I thought at first that you meant you were permanently emigrating. But if not then my opinion is, well, you gotta do what you gotta do. If the work is there, go for it. Keep out of trouble, come home safe and with a further desire to end the bloody and divisive system called capitalism.

If you are emigrating permanently, on the other hand, then my opinion is, I hope you find opportunities to get involved in bringing down said bloody and divisive system.

And, once again, good luck.

Anarchia's picture
Anarchia
Offline
Joined: 18-03-06
Jul 8 2010 10:29
Quote:
Are the IWW operative in Israel?

No.

sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Jul 8 2010 10:36

Thanks slothjabber,

Nothing final about the transfer. I have to go through this whole BS process. It would most likely be 8 months to a year before it happend.

The Gulf and Greece were apart of my travels. I probably spent maybe a week in each place. If I was to relocate to Israel though it would be for the long term.

posi
Offline
Joined: 24-09-05
Jul 8 2010 11:18

I believe that poster eyal r is involved in union activity in Israel.

there are some good things going on. There is this: http://workers.org.il/english/ - which is a small but real alternative to the Histadrut - 5,000ish? I understand that people from the CWI -- Trotskyists linked to the British Socialist Party, the only real organised Trotskyist group in Israel -- are central.

I believe this is also a good organisation, involved in some practical stuff, including opposition to the Histadrut if necessary: http://www.hotline.org.il/english/index.htm -- I think perhaps they are more radical in person than the website makes it sound.

plus there's the Alternative Information Centre, and these: http://www.laborers-voice.org/ -- former Maoists I think, split from Matzpen ages ago.

Thrashing_chomsky
Offline
Joined: 3-06-07
Jul 8 2010 11:24

Learn Krav Maga.
youtube

Tojiah's picture
Tojiah
Offline
Joined: 2-10-06
Jul 8 2010 19:06

I'll just flat out ask you: are you a Jew planning on obtaining citizenship ("making Aliyah"? Because if you're not, and you become active in the AAtW, you'll be a prime target for immediate deportation. The police has no qualms in using the Interior Ministry unit in charge of illegal immigrants in order to deport people before they've had a chance to go through a judicial review (which would prove that they weren't here illegally, or that there are no charges that would stick, etc).
If you are, well, there are many benefits to immigrating Jews, subsidized Hebrew lessons, etc.. People have a different view of personal space than you're used to from the States, though you may have already encountered that in other Levantine/Middle Eastern regions you've visited..

Black Badger
Offline
Joined: 21-03-07
Jul 8 2010 19:10

If you get the chance, I highly recommend a day trip (or even a weekend) to Ein Gedi for a hike to some of the most beautiful waterfalls ever. Not to be missed if you like nature even a little.

sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Jul 8 2010 20:10
Tojiah wrote:
I'll just flat out ask you: are you a Jew planning on obtaining citizenship ("making Aliyah"? Because if you're not, and you become active in the AAtW, you'll be a prime target for immediate deportation. The police has no qualms in using the Interior Ministry unit in charge of illegal immigrants in order to deport people before they've had a chance to go through a judicial review (which would prove that they weren't here illegally, or that there are no charges that would stick, etc).
If you are, well, there are many benefits to immigrating Jews, subsidized Hebrew lessons, etc.. People have a different view of personal space than you're used to from the States, though you may have already encountered that in other Levantine/Middle Eastern regions you've visited..

No, most of my heritage comes from Nazi-land actually cry.

epk's picture
epk
Offline
Joined: 10-02-07
Oct 10 2010 23:20
posi wrote:
I believe that poster eyal r is involved in union activity in Israel.

Yes I am... I had a term on Koach La-Ovdim's comptrol committee, and working on junior academic staff unionization in my own university. Very challenging business with short-term workers who are generally quite passive and subservient. Sorry I'm not in the forum more to talk about it.

posi wrote:
Ithere are some good things going on. There is this: http://workers.org.il/english/ - which is a small but real alternative to the Histadrut - 5,000ish? I understand that people from the CWI -- Trotskyists linked to the British Socialist Party, the only real organised Trotskyist group in Israel -- are central.

They're not so central. The centrals are social-democrat labor party refugees. And Koach La-Ovdim is quickly becoming exactly what it set out to be: A social-democratic union in the sad tradition of these north European unions. centralization of power and the emergence of a bureaucratic caste are apparent; it's quite interesting to see these things develop right before your eyes in the nascent stages.

Still, it's much better than the Histadrut.

posi wrote:
I believe this is also a good organisation, involved in some practical stuff, including opposition to the Histadrut if necessary: http://www.hotline.org.il/english/index.htm -- I think perhaps they are more radical in person than the website makes it sound.

Also, http://www.kavlaoved.org.il/ . But neither of these are unions - they're NGOs which help individual workers or workers as "humans with rights". They don't do organizing (which would be extremely difficult, BTW, with migrant workers).

posi wrote:
plus there's the Alternative Information Centre, and these:

Not really involved in class issues.

posi wrote:
http://www.laborers-voice.org/ -- former Maoists I think, split from Matzpen ages ago.

Nope, you're mistaking them with other people. Sawt Al-Aamel is somewhat affiliated with Bshara's NDA (liberal nationalists); I say 'somewhat' because it doesn't really fit. They do mostly anti-workfare awareness raising and public protest and legal aid.

epk's picture
epk
Offline
Joined: 10-02-07
Oct 10 2010 23:37

sabot: By the way, my instinct would be to say: Don't come, unless you're coming to be actively involved in struggle. Remember Israel only allows the influx of people it finds acceptable. e.g. nice white European or Americans are well-liked here.

From your initial description it sounds like you're relocating as an employee of a large company?

gypsy
Offline
Joined: 20-09-09
Oct 11 2010 04:26
sabot wrote:
Tojiah wrote:
I'll just flat out ask you: are you a Jew planning on obtaining citizenship ("making Aliyah"? Because if you're not, and you become active in the AAtW, you'll be a prime target for immediate deportation. The police has no qualms in using the Interior Ministry unit in charge of illegal immigrants in order to deport people before they've had a chance to go through a judicial review (which would prove that they weren't here illegally, or that there are no charges that would stick, etc).
If you are, well, there are many benefits to immigrating Jews, subsidized Hebrew lessons, etc.. People have a different view of personal space than you're used to from the States, though you may have already encountered that in other Levantine/Middle Eastern regions you've visited..

No, most of my heritage comes from Nazi-land actually cry.

Did you move to Israel then? You finding it ok?

posi
Offline
Joined: 24-09-05
Oct 11 2010 09:11
Quote:
Koach La-Ovdim is quickly becoming exactly what it set out to be: A social-democratic union in the sad tradition of these north European unions. centralization of power and the emergence of a bureaucratic caste are apparent; it's quite interesting to see these things develop right before your eyes in the nascent stages.

Still, it's much better than the Histadrut.

article? Good to have this stuff examined in detail, rather than always talking about them in the abstract...

sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Oct 11 2010 22:39
Eyal Rozenberg wrote:
sabot: By the way, my instinct would be to say: Don't come, unless you're coming to be actively involved in struggle. Remember Israel only allows the influx of people it finds acceptable. e.g. nice white European or Americans are well-liked here.

From your initial description it sounds like you're relocating as an employee of a large company?

Yes, if I find the appropriate organization/movement to mix in with if I ever made it over there...I'd remain active. Out of curiousity, why did you say "dont come" if otherwise?

Yes, I work for an employeer that would offer the opportunity to transfer to that region.

Haven't moved yet...still in the good ole USA. There are a lot of people in my company who are shuffling around and i'm just waiting for things to calm down.

epk's picture
epk
Offline
Joined: 10-02-07
Nov 19 2010 15:08

sabot: Don't come because the native population doesn't want more immigrants strengthening the colony. Really, don't come. Don't increase our numbers. Like you wouldn't move to Algeria if you were a conscious French person in the 1950s.

posi wrote:
article? Good to have this stuff examined in detail, rather than always talking about them in the abstract...

I have a nice report about these things. Very useful actually for union members and organizers in general. It's 40,000 words long, a half-year's work on my part. Only problem is that it's in Hebrew. If people pester me enough I'll get around to translating it (I'm 3% done).

sabot's picture
sabot
Offline
Joined: 21-06-08
Nov 23 2010 16:21
Eyal Rozenberg wrote:
Don't come because the native population doesn't want more immigrants strengthening the colony.

I thought you said Israel liked us yanks??? Of the few people that I know who have transfered over there said they loved it.