Zeitgeist anyone?

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Lizzifer
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Oct 29 2009 10:45
Zeitgeist anyone?

Hello Forum prowlers!

I'm new to this particular website, but I'm certainly not new to the world of Anarchy, mainly due to the disgust and disbelief with the way the world is today, all because of greed, money, and the power of few... I mean 1% of the population controlling 80% of the world's wealth, something is fucked up along the line, eh?
My apologies for my first post being an advertisment of sorts, but I believe that people with similar ideas and passions should get together to become a stronger group.

So I was wondering, has anyone here heard of The Zeitgeist Movement?
Are you involved with it at the moment?
Or even if you're against it or uninterested, I would still love to know why, I imagine the people here are more capable of constructive critisism than a lot of the other people on the street I've talked to.

Thank you for reading, I would post up URLs, but I'm not here to pressure people, mostly discussion and sharing of ideas =)
If you're interested, don't be afraid to PM me, or just use ol' faithful google =P

Peace!
Liz
x

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Khawaga
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Oct 29 2009 17:31

Welcome to the boards Lizzifer!

There have been a few discussions about Zeitgeist on these forums. Generally they're seen as an outgrowth of conspiracy theories around the federal reserve, or if you want to be nicer, that they are a (commodity) fetishistic movement.

You can check out these past discussions on Zeitgeist.

http://libcom.org/forums/news/who-fuck-are-zeitgeist-movement-14052009

http://libcom.org/forums/theory/zeitgeist-07012009

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jambo1
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Oct 29 2009 19:35

not more zeitgeist shite!! has this not been done to death on other forums as well. its the haunt of conspiracy nut jobs and weirdies!! Liz i find it full of dressed up bullshit and conspiracy nonsense. hi by the way!!

Lizzifer
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Oct 31 2009 10:02

Hey, I'm sorry if I touched a raw nerve, and for not checking previous talks... I find it strange how most people concentrate around the 9/11 stuff and some of the other conspiracy ideas, it's all down to personal opinion as you start off with that route. Especially when you start talking about religion as well, it will always be a touchy subject, because it's down to faith.
Fair enough it's all in the first movie, but I usually give EVERYTHING a chance to elaborate, and the idea of a corrupt goverment made me smile inwardly, it's pretty obvious that the majority of politicians aren't in it because they care about the community.

I'm personally more interested in the desired outcome of the Movement...
It is perfectly plausable in my opinion, to suggest that as a society we could easily feed and clothe everyone on Earth, or at least educate the majority to know how to purify water for example...
I believe it is also a decent thing to say that we have 'outgrown' the use of money, as when I look at cash, I personally just see "IOU" (I promise to pay the bearer the sum of... blah blah blah); as it just seems to be a waste of time - bearing in mind that nearly everyone has the mental and physical capacity to feed themselves with the right ingredients and clothe themselves with the correct education and access to tools.

I've been called a Neo-Marxist, a Crazy, a Socialist, and Idealistic Airhead... I just find it hard to take in when all I want is the world to be evened out using our fecking brilliant brains and the wonderful inventions of others.

Anyway, cheers for listening to this nutcase =P
Liz
x

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Khawaga
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Oct 31 2009 14:03
Liz wrote:
I believe it is also a decent thing to say that we have 'outgrown' the use of money, as when I look at cash, I personally just see "IOU" (I promise to pay the bearer the sum of... blah blah blah); as it just seems to be a waste of time

Two words: commodity fetishism.

Lizzifer
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Nov 1 2009 17:11
weeler wrote:
Liz, did you read either of the threads linked?

Yes, I did... a few of the things said upset me, as a lot of the people I talk to don't seem to be crazies, they just want the best for everyone...
and to be honest, I didn't understand a few of the arguments against, perhaps I'm not on the same level as a lot of you guys, I'm trying to become more intelligent, but it's not easy when a lot of the things I am against, and hence have no real passion for, I'm afraid I'm lacking in the technical terms.
And a lot of the other arguements seemed to be focused around the conspiracies; heck even I know a lot of the facts in the first movie were pretty dubious, but the conspiracy side (well apart from the 1% controlling 80% wealth, that got me because it's pure corruption) isn't what got me into the Movement at all, so I didn't really feel the need to concern myself with those particular points.

But like I said, I'm not here to recruit or anything, you guys seem to have level heads and true belief of what you're doing, I respect that very much.
It's nice to meet a bunch of people online who aren't backwards tradition-holding material bigots ^_^

But I don't expect you to waste your time on this thread, you all seem to have your minds made up, which is fine by me, since you're doing such a great job with your own agenda (nice for whoever got the norwich underground path).
A lot of people haven't seen the third film either, which is probably the more activist side of it.

Thanks again for reading
Liz
x

Lizzifer
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Nov 1 2009 17:13
Khawaga wrote:
Liz wrote:
I believe it is also a decent thing to say that we have 'outgrown' the use of money, as when I look at cash, I personally just see "IOU" (I promise to pay the bearer the sum of... blah blah blah); as it just seems to be a waste of time

Two words: commodity fetishism.

Yes, Karl Marx's description fits perfectly.

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Ambrose
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Nov 26 2011 15:24

Zeitgeist was what turned me from mainstreamism and "opened my eye's" so to speak, it does this for a lot of people.

Most people in the US are right-wing or at least most of the people in my experience so this likely appeals quite strongly. The religion topic was my personal favorite and is actually really good; although I was an Atheist anyway at the time so anything that shoots down religion just short of black propaganda is good in my book.

9/11 stuff has some good points, looks just like a controlled demolition and it's not like false-flag terrorist attacks are unheard of. As Anarchists, I'd think the reaction would be more akin to "yeah yeah, what do ya expect?" than "goddamn conspiracy buffs". Even declassified documents of plans that were drawn up for that.

I've read some of the critique's and I just don't understand the hostility towards it. They are ideologically similar (at least to Anarcho-Communists) in their opposition to monetarism, which is a breath of fresh air compared to "class struggle" arguments.

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Chilli Sauce
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Nov 26 2011 15:40
Quote:
They are ideologically similar (at least to Anarcho-Communists) in their opposition to monetarism, which is a breath of fresh air compared to "class struggle" arguments.

One one hand, you're right, if anarchists just bang on about "class war" we're not going to be well received. On the other hand, the most active and growing anarchist groups are based on practical activity and using the space opened up by struggle to discuss things like class, capitalism, etc.

And I think it's fair to say that relating to people about material issues is far more effective than discussing "monetarism" with them...

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Ambrose
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Nov 29 2011 02:23

I agree, the fact that it's almost all talk, no show is what turned me off from it. That and their technocratic solution just didn't fly with me.

In my experience monetarism has had some success for the already left-wingers, helps sway folks from Stalinism and Neo-Liberalism.

Monetarist argument doesn't work so much with anyone on the right or an-caps (especially the an-caps). Just depends on the folks I guess.