Plan C website launched - check it out

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Spikymike
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Oct 26 2017 15:53

Serge - maybe a bit premature and harsh. The latest addition to the Plan discussion amongst themselves by Kai seems to draw back a bit from the over enthusiasm expressed by others and prefers to concentrate on other of Plan C's existing (so far unproven) strategies whilst avoiding any kind of split with those members of Plan C who clearly do want to 'engage' more directly with The LP and Momentum. That statement remains pretty confused in my opinion - more concerned with trying to justify a claimed distinctive Plan C politics that fails to convince. I'm aware that some of Plan C's earlier members left some time back for a mixture of reasons so that may happen again as things pan out and divisions continue in practice.

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Nov 1 2017 08:40

A recent article on the Plan C website:

Quote:
‘If there is hope, it lies with the Labour Party’
Quote:
The latest contribution to our series on the Labour Party is by Plan C members Camille Barbagallo, Nicholas Beuret, and David Harvie.

https://www.weareplanc.org/blog/if-there-is-hope-it-lies-with-the-labour-party/

Dannny
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Nov 1 2017 10:02
rat wrote:
A recent article on the Plan C website:
Quote:
‘If there is hope, it lies with the Labour Party’
Quote:
The latest contribution to our series on the Labour Party is by Plan C members Camille Barbagallo, Nicholas Beuret, and David Harvie.

https://www.weareplanc.org/blog/if-there-is-hope-it-lies-with-the-labour-party/

Somewhat misleading headline:

Quote:
There is hope and, we are repeatedly told, that hope is to be found in the Labour Party.

We dissent from this view. We want to suggest that the turn towards a Labour Party campaigning on a social democratic manifesto isn’t a sign of increasing power for anti-capitalist social movements, but something that signals a profound crisis. Not only a weakness of the Left, or of radical social movements, or even of revolutionary groups like Plan C. More than this, it signals a serious crisis of our class. This electoral turn, like most electoral turns, is a sign of crisis of working-class power. Imagine for a moment that we had the power to truly transform the state and its complicity with capital… but then, why would we bother? If we have the power to transform the capitalist state, then we have no need to transform the state: we can simply transform society. The idea that we need the state to mediate our power is a sign of crisis in our capacity to act.

Spikymike
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Nov 1 2017 12:43

Danny is right that the last quoted Plan C post is much better seeming to make at least a similar point to that in my earlier post No 28 and without making any great claims for Plan C's politics being in advance of everyone else, though leaves all of us still struggling to see positive ways forward at present.

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Oranj
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Nov 1 2017 22:05

Plan Corbyn is Plan Bollocks.

Very disappointed in them.

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dark_ether
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Nov 6 2017 00:39

Be interested to see some more critical content about Corbyn and the potential next Labour government from them, or even a direct response to this open letter:
https://afed.org.uk/the-world-transformed-or-staying-the-same-an-open-letter-to-plan-c/

Spikymike
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Nov 7 2017 18:14

Yes a useful criticism by the AF and a relevant comparison with the experience of Big Flame. I noticed that Plan C considered it worth interviewing Max Farrar about his experiences with the old Big Flame group in there short lived BAMN journal (although chose not to mention his now support for Hizmet).

ajjohnstone
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Nov 7 2017 21:41

Indeed that open letter was well worth the read and put much into perspective

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Nov 8 2017 22:01

It is a good article by Bonnie VandeSteeg and Nick Heath and deserves a reply from Plan C.
Any chance of that I wonder?

Spikymike
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Nov 9 2017 13:09

Well this latest contribution from a Plan C member (see https://www.weareplanc.org/blog/corbyn-statecraft-and-radical-politics-an-autonomist-and-left-libertarian-caution/) seems to take on board at least some of the criticism in the AF Open Letter and seeks to preserve Plan C's independence from the Labour Party/Momentum whirlwind but still allow some 'individual' members to sink much of their efforts in precisely that direction. Whilst wanting to keep independent of parliamentary politics and what it describes as national 'statecraft' it is still open to dabbling in a bit of radical municipalism. Keeping their common identity as part of 'the Left', even if that is only its insignificant experimental fringe, seems more important to them than coming to any definitive collective opposition to both capitalism and it's supportive state apparatus at all levels.

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John Muir
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Nov 16 2017 10:45
Dannny wrote:
rat wrote:
A recent article on the Plan C website:
Quote:
‘If there is hope, it lies with the Labour Party’
Quote:
The latest contribution to our series on the Labour Party is by Plan C members Camille Barbagallo, Nicholas Beuret, and David Harvie.

https://www.weareplanc.org/blog/if-there-is-hope-it-lies-with-the-labour-party/

Somewhat misleading headline

The title is an almost-quote from George Orwell. In 1984, the hopeless Winston keeps repeating, "If there is hope it lies with the proles".

Spikymike
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Dec 18 2017 10:42

Manchester Plan C have now picked up on the appalling conditions for housing renters and others in the Greater Manchester area that our local community rag in Salford (and Rob Ray here) have been plugging away at for some time now and plan they say to put some initial efforts into forming a Manchester version of the ACORN union that has had some limited successes around renter issues in Sheffield and elsewhere. Their campaign statement still expresses illusions in Left Labour and an illusory ''power of community organising expressed in the recent election'' but I suppose this turn might have some benefits if others get involved. Still have to wonder how much this is genuinely about 'self organisation' of our class rather than self-promotion of Plan C, most of whom still imagine themselves to have some unique role as the instigators, dare I say 'leaders' of some new social movement?

Spikymike
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Jan 16 2018 17:23

Comrades from the 'Angry Workers World' group in London have previously engaged politically with Plan C around their discussions on the concept of a 'Social Strike'. I'd like to think that some at least in Plan C might take note of this critical text from the same source if they are to avoid sinking still further into the the morass of swampy leftism represented by Momentum and the Corbyn lead Labour Party.
https://libcom.org/blog/migration-national-social-democracy-britain-15012018

Spikymike
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Mar 23 2018 12:26

Picking up on earlier comments about Paul Mason and the aspirations to influence the Labour Party and indirectly national and local state policy via either established or unofficially recognised think tanks, I noticed that Plan C member Eleanor Penny has contributed a piece on the recent 'Women's Strike' initiative with some reasonable sounding aspirations (as I referred to them earlier in my post no 14) but wholly within a reformist framework that avoids relating these to the fundamental barriers of capitalism and class struggle and which she originally contributed to 'The Progressive Policy Think Tank' that has these objectives: https://www.ippr.org/about
Just reinforces to my mind much of the other criticism made on here and other related links mentioned earlier.

Spikymike
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Apr 7 2018 10:18

The Mike Harman/QQ extended critical text here:
http://libcom.org/blog/poverty-luxury-communism-05042018
is well worth a link to this discussion of the fault-lines in Plan C's politics and it's drift towards left reformism even if Plan C are reluctant to respond publicly to such.

Spikymike
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Apr 12 2018 16:52

And of course keeping the discussion going even if Plan C members are keeping their eyes closed this critical text hits home on a number of levels:
https://libcom.org/blog/back-future-rebranding-social-democracy-12042018

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Red Marriott
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Apr 12 2018 17:32

This thread should really be re-titled as 'The latest new depths to which Plan C have sunk'.

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Steven.
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Apr 12 2018 22:14

Plan C is sounding an awful lot like they just should have called themselves Plan B*

* This is a Keynesianism joke, not a morning after pill joke

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Apr 15 2018 09:19

The 'Shop' section on their website says a lot:

Rojava Mug